Lord Wulfengheist
Amarr
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
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Posted - 2011.08.17 15:32:00 -
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Edited by: Lord Wulfengheist on 17/08/2011 15:35:02
Edited by: Lord Wulfengheist on 17/08/2011 15:33:55
Adhocracy Incorporated has been in wormholes since they came out, and that includes me.
A hulk is, when fully fit, nearly 200m.
A covetor breaks what? 20 if you try really hard?
We've already established that wormholes are dangerous. Before you can begin to make the connection that "experienced pilots are safer" tell me this. Which ship is flown more? What is the ship distribution? Could it be that 26% of hulks die in W space because only 30% of the total hulks in game are there?
More likely, the kill discrepency is the result of more covetors being flown more than simply hulk pilots getting away. After all, a covetor is worth a fifth a hulk, so they're a surer bet to fly.
But even if you are perfectly right, and W space is as "safe" as nullsec, why should ore be pulled from WH's then? If it's en par safety wise with nullsec, any boost to nullsec should by applied to wormholes, or at the very least, wormholes should not be nerfed.
Someone else in the past mentioned the logistics they go through. Even a rorqual does not aid that too much despite the ore compression. The ore still needs to be moved out, refined, and brought back or refined locally at a 25% loss rate. But I've heard talks of day trippers ruining the market. That's BS as well.
Usually, the only thing they go home in is a body bag, but assuming they mine completely alone.
Mass:
Orca (we're going to go full on mining operation here to even make it worth it)
250kt each way, so assuming it only goes back and forth, 500kt
Covetor, x5 [or hulk, but mass is the same]
40kt each way, times 5, so 400kt
Support fleet (this, more often than not, is left in K space, but we're going for a realistically safe fleet)
Average for Cruiser/BCs, about 15kt. Assuming 5 ships, which would probably deter 1-3 t3's, that's 150kt.
Mammoth haulers (make math easy and say 30km3 holds)
30kt per trip, for the 5 covetors w/bonuses, you'd want 2, so 60kt per trip. We'll say they make 5 trips, for a total of 600km3 hauled and 300kt through the hole.
That adds up to 500+400+150+300=1350kt easy through the wormhole. Depending on the system, that may not even make it all through, even dropping the support fleet. (Wormholes allow for roughly 1000kt through and up, with most of them allowing around 2000kt, though to support the orca, the latter mass limit is most likely).
So, assuming they find a completely empty, unused hole, and do not die, what did this shindig make?
Let's use Grey Scales numbers!
This load, assuming it's all ABC, would be: 37% ark, 29% bistot, and 34% crokite.
For the sake of argument, I'm going to assume the ore is simply sold as ore, as refining is fairly heavily player dependent.
6937 Ark @ 2500ea (Buy) = 17,342,500
5437 Bistot @ 2100ea (Buy) = 11,417,700
6375 Crokite @ 2300ea (Buy)= 14,662,500
So, assuming you sell outright, you've made 43m. Put up a sell order, ideally you make 86m. Refine, sell all minerals, etc, you get what, 150m?
Congrats, a few hours worth of work has left each pilot 20m (with no support fleet).
Ergo, hisec day trippers are not a factor. And I will also back up everyone else saying that mining is a time killer more than anything.
But, I will end this wall with a restatement of a previous point. If WH's and Nullsec are truly equally safe, which you're data then should the rewards not be the same?
PS: I don't even know what to say about your production data. Tell my exactly what is produced and what it costs and what had to be left over, not just an assumed relationship, and I might listen.
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